Arts Presenters and FCC Host Conference Call on Ceasing Wireless Microphone Operations in the 700 MHz Band February 2, 2010

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1 TRANSCRIPT Matthew: My name is Matt Nodine. I am the chief of staff of the wireless bureau at the FCC. We have been working with wireless mic order for some time now, especially on the outreach side. Sitting here with me in my office is Paul Murray. Paul: Yes. This is Paul Murray. Matthew: So what would you like us to do? Just talk very briefly about the order? How would you like to proceed here? Leah: I think we should just go off the agenda I sent you earlier, and just talk about the order, the timeline, the transition period, and the part 15 eligibility and how part 74 is affected as well. Paul: All right. I will start with this as George Wheeler who we know here at the commission. I am glad he is there to help you all understand this. There are plenty of websites. There is a link at the FCC website that can answer a lot of these questions in a very big picture manner. The general idea is the 700 megahertz spectrum which is frequency 698 to 806 used to be 52 to 69. Those were UHF channels when the commission decided to update. Paul: When the commission decided to convert these with Congress behind it to the digital television, the television potentially (00:02:41) and the 700 megahertz spectrum was made available for public safety uses and new consumer wireless services. The whole idea here is that it is no longer okay for wireless microphones and other part 74 devices to continue to operate in the 700 megahertz band because they will interfere with public safety and commercial users that now will operate in the band. The finalized rule that said that no longer can microphones or part 74 devices that operate in the 700 megahertz band continue to operate after June the twelfth of That is essentially what the order did. It also, for the first time, authorized the use of these by entities that often did not have licenses. The whole idea is to communicate that no longer can these microphones be used in the 700 megahertz band, but it is possible to use other spectrum bands including the ED white spaces. That is where the white spaces come in. The FCC has a proceeding now where it is examining what rule for operation of wireless microphones would be finalized in what we call now the court TV band where digital television is, also known as white spaces. I am happy, and it is a very complicated decision. The thrust of it is to find out if you have a 700 megahertz wireless microphone. If you have some other microphone, then you do not need to worry at this point. If you do have a 700 megahertz microphone, you need to get out of the band no later than the twelfth of June. Page 1 of 14

2 Participant: Is there going to be any kind of assistance for anybody who has a system in that frequency range? Is there anything out there to help? We have a 20,000 dollar system that is in that frequency range. That is going to be a very difficult expenditure to take on here (00:05:10) it being wide open and no sign that this is coming. Paul: Well actually, different people have known that this has been coming for a long time. It has been; and I do not want to get into the details of who knew exactly what, when, where, and how because it is a very complicated history. The FCC in August of 2008 said it was going to do something like this. Participant: I am aware of it today. We had already purchased our microphone system prior to that time frame. Paul: Right. Participant: Is there going to be anything government wise in place where possibly they would help in the cost of re-crystalling so that we can change bands? Paul: There is no government plan at this point. There are manufacturers and they offer various rebates, but it is not something that the government is involved with. Sandra: This is Sandra, and I will say that we have not only been talking to the FCC, we have been on the hill and we have had conversations with the White House. One of our requests is for consideration of some consideration for our constituents to be able to make this transition. We do know that a couple of manufacturers are offering small discounts. We are trying to actually get in contact with other manufacturers to see if there could be more assistance. We realize that many of you have been equipped, and this does mean a serious transition and quite an expense to move into the new bandwidth. One of the reasons we wanted to organize this call is so that you can ask these questions and get more clarification on the qualifications to move to the rest of the band. Participant: That would be great. I would love as much information as possible towards any help I can get towards fixing this issue. I mean I am a 1000 person venue in Macon, Georgia and it is hard enough to keep our head above water. This is quite an expenditure that is going to befall us. That is for sure. Paul: You have already determined that they operate in the 700 megahertz band I gather? Participant: Oh absolutely, yes. Yes. That is part of the reason why I am on this call. I already know that I am in that frequency range and I want to do what I can to comply to the issue, but I want to find out everything I can that is going to help me make it happen. Page 2 of 14

3 Paul: Well, thank you for being on the call. Leah: Let us continue. Matthew here probably has more to add. Paul: I do not know whether George wants to talk about any issues, but there is an ongoing proceeding. You were talking about white spaces which I am not sure; I do not know how much the folks on the phone follow that. That is what we here often call the new home for wireless microphones in so far as that is where a lot of people who unfortunately have 700 megahertz microphones will need to migrate to. There is an ongoing proceeding there, and that proceeding which is part of the same order is asking what the final rule should look like in terms of operation of wireless microphones by different entities. I do not know how many of you are aware, but until the order came out in January here, there was only a small class of users who were even authorized under the FCC rules to operate wireless microphones under part 74. Many of you do not fall into that class. The question is should they? The FCC is now allowing you to operate under certain technical rules. The FCC is examining what precisely those technical rules should look like going forward in the white spaces. George: Matthew? This is George. I think maybe it is helpful to lay out a little bit of a timeline here. Leah: I was just going to ask that. George: The FCC adopted its decision on the fourteenth of January. The rules that required that the shift in frequencies take place went into effect on January 22, and basically what the FCC did was to set a deadline of June twelfth of 2010 as the date when all wireless mic users should be out of the spectrum above 698 megahertz. The FCC attempted to provide a sort of soft landing. They knew that this was going to be very disruptive and there had to be a way if you were getting out of the 700 megahertz band that you had a place to go. I think the preliminary conclusion that the commission came to was to shift down into TV core spectrum; in other words, channel 51 and below. That decision comes with a number of sort of unknowns however. At the same time as Matthew mentioned, there is a rule making proceeding which is intended to create a sort of permanent regulation for the use of wireless microphones in the TV core. The rule making proceeding that Matthew referred to is just beginning. There will be comments on how the FCC should handle wireless mics on a permanent basis due on February twenty-second. Then there will be another round to make submissions on March the fifteenth. The FCC has said that while this rule making proceeding is underway that the blanket waiver that they granted for existing wireless microphone users to shift down into the TV core will remain in effect. The uncertainties are that issues shift down into the core on an interim basis while this rule making proceeding is still pending, you have to sort of anticipate whether the retuning that you do, the re-crystalling that you do is going to cause you to end up in the right spectrum so that you do not have to do it all Page 3 of 14

4 over again. I guess I wonder, Matthew given that some thought, is there any sort of advice to current wireless mic users who are going to be doing re-crystalling before the June twelfth about how they should handle that? Are they in some jeopardy that they are going to have to do it all over again? Is there some procedure they can follow where they could avoid this sort of second round of re-crystalling? Matthew: George. It was Paul Murray speaking most of the time here. George: Okay. Matthew: That is all right. Thank you for explaining that much more clearly than I did. What the commission has done, again picking up on what George said, is it has tried to make a home. At this point it is a temporary home with a temporary set of rules subject to final rule making. At this point, anybody that has a wireless microphone can continue to operate in the 700 megahertz band until June twelfth, unless they were actually causing interference to a public safety area which will only happen in very few markets. They will operate under a certain set of guidelines now, but they will be going to the core TV spectrum. I think the answer is we propose particular rules right now that look very much like the rules that people are operating under on an interim basis asking whether those are the right rules. They all permit operation in the core TV bands asking whether that is the right plan going forward. We also ask whether we should we should expand the class of users who could operate these devices at higher power levels that expand the licensee class. Anybody can operate it without a license. Some people get some additional protections as licensees. We are taking the status quo. We are letting people continue to operate in the 700 megahertz band until the twelfth. Then they can operate in the core TV bands under the same rules. We are asking about those same rules. At this point, the commission does not anticipate changes that would interfere with the rules that we are asking people to operate under right now. George: The 64 dollar question, Matthew and Paul, is if someone wants to shift down into the TV core now? Matthew: They can. They absolutely can. George: And to avoid the additional expense of shifting down to one frequency and then finding out, well the FCC adopted rules which actually do not fit with my operations or which cause interference to my operations, or would not permit me to operate on that frequency so that I have to shift again. One thought would be if this proposal that the FCC has made about the future rules is pretty, how do I say; it is your best thinking about it. Maybe the answer is that we ought to look at those proposed rules and anticipate whether we could comply with the proposed rules in the expectation that if they do get adopted we do not have to change anything. Page 4 of 14

5 Matthew: That is certainly exactly what as a starting point you all should do. Look at the temporary rules right now and see how they work, assuming they operate in the core TV band like that on a going forward basis and the commission finalizes those rules. That is absolutely correct. I was going to say that there are different rules for operation, depending on whether you are a licensee operating in the core TV band or an unlicensed user operating in the core TV band. Those are the particular about operational parameters and eligibility for licenses parameters that we are looking at in the commission order. That is the kind of feedback the commission needs to determine whether the current operating rules that we are setting forth now on a temporary basis should be the same as going forward. There is no; again I cannot control the commission, but I do not think there is any thinking at this point that it would change the bands in which you would operate. The particular frequency bands and the core TV spectrum in which you would operate. Having said that, George you are in a good position to inform them the additional uncertainty that George is talking about involves how does the commission? The commission has more than just wireless microphones and related equipment to solve in the white spaces. It has in the white spaces proceedings; it has a large number of users each of whom would like to use that spectrum in ways that satisfy their needs. In particular, there are people that want to use white space devices that are not wireless microphones on an unlicensed basis as well. You have competing interest in the white spaces proceeding which has to be resolved for the commission to decide exactly what rule is going forward that should apply to wireless microphones, should apply to other users, should apply to the licensees and the other licensees in the band. As a starting premise, I think you need to look at the proposed rules that are in the order that came out that talk about the operation of wireless microphones in the core TV bands on a going forward basis. George: I think this might be a good time to actually outline very briefly the two main proposals that the FCC has for people who are going to be operating in the TV core on a permanent basis. I will start with the two are sort of unlicensed (00:20:00) operations, which the FCC calls wireless audio devices. Then the licensed alternative, which is very similar to the type of licensing that broadcaster, TV networks, cable operators, and movie producers currently enjoy with their wireless mic operations. The FCC is basically setting up a licensing opportunity as one of the possible destinations for operations on a permanent basis in the TV core spectrum. The value of licensing as you may have guessed is that you have enhanced interference protection as against white space devices. You are permitted, and I will just leave it there. You also have interference protections as against all unlicensed operations. You have flexibility to conduct twoway wireless mic related operations. Queuing is permitted for licensed operations for production personnel. It also permits certain types of uses of wireless devices to key stage hands, so sort of backstage uses which are related to performance. All are encompassed under the authority which licensed operators to which they are entitled. Then Matthew and Paul mentioned earlier that in addition, they are permitted to operate up to a max power of 250 millowatts. It may sound Page 5 of 14

6 like a big number, but some people presumably have those kinds of requirements. Let me contrast this with the sort of unlicensed equivalent. Matthew and Paul, if I am misinterpreting what the FCC's proposals are please correct me. On the unlicensed side, if you chose not to be licensed, it seems like first of all the only sort of interference protection that you would enjoy would be to operate on certain set aside channels in the TV core where white space devices are not allowed to operate. I think this is a proposal in the commission's order, but it says that such operations will be limited to 50 millowatts, 5-0 millowatts max power and would probably be limited to one-way only operations. I think perhaps you; and they would be prohibited from using any frequency which is co-channeled with a primary TV station in a specified separation distance. It is a different type of operation which could perhaps be accommodated under the FCC's unlicensed wireless audio device proposals. Based on the conversations that Leah and I have had with some of the performing arts organizations that are involved in this same issue, it seems as if the queuing and the backstage kind of radio access, the two-way capabilities are very much a part of the performance experience and part of the production values which have been built into certainly into any sort of serious professional production. It looks to us for this particular community of users, that licensed use has a lot of the characteristics which really are the bedrock of any sort of quality performance. We are probably headed in that direction. Now I will stop talking for a moment and let other people sort of think about what I have just said. I guess first off, Paul and Matthew; have I said anything wrong so far? Matthew: I do not believe so with a caveat George, I pushed the wrong button and cut us off for about a minute. Everything I heard you say sounded right. I guess the most important, just to step back a bit, important thing for us to do at the commission we saw was to have a full record before us based on the needs that are out there and the competing needs for the TV white spaces, and how to see how the FCC can do its best to accommodate the various users with their real needs. The problem with the core TV bands is there are a lot of people in it. Finding the best way of figuring out how everybody fits in it was a difficult issue. The commission did not feel ready to make that decision. You are talking about how does the commission go forward and design a set of rules that obviously from your point of view do the best to make sure that the needs of your clients are met. Getting to the bottom of it of precisely who needs what, who really needs license protection; that is a core issue in the notice of proposed rule making. Getting to that kind of thing and what is critical to your folks is very important for the commission to hear. George: Okay. I wonder if people who are on the call might want to, or Leah do you think we should stop and ask people? Leah: I think it is a great time for folks to ask your questions. I have already seen several great questions come through the online portion of this. Just identify yourself and ask the question. Page 6 of 14

7 Matt: Hi. This is Matt Nodine in the commission. I have been watching some of these questions come across, and they are great questions. I think before we open it up, maybe if we can provide some additional perspectives that might answer some of these questions that have already been asked. To do that let me kind of explain some of the background of this proceeding. As Paul has mentioned earlier, Congress mandated that we make that transitions from analog to digital. That was the whole DTV transition that occurred on June twelfth of Some of the questions have come across; how is the commission going to police this and those types of things. Here is where we are. Participant: There are penalties that are going to be associated with wireless microphone system user who is using their wireless microphone system in the 700 megahertz range after June 12 th. We don t know we can comment on what we believe those are going to be. And that s probably going to be a, a fairly wide range of both civil and potentially criminal penalties. And it will be looked at on a case by case basis. Paul: Let me just, this is Paul Murray again. The fear of course, is the really, the downside is that, is that interference occurs in an emergency and something bad happens. A life is lost or whatever. So, instead of, I think the view is from the commission is we want you to get out regardless because of the potential for interference. And, and, these microphones would be working on the same spectrum. There is that potential that they will interfere with public safety. And the same would go true for commercial users of spectrum. Or consumer users that come into the van. Participant: And as far as some of the other questions, Bill. What I d like to do for those who are on there is give you my address. For instance, the question asking in some private theaters, is it possible to get a license. We can answer those on a case by case basis as they come in. So, let me give you my address right now. It s So if you have those types of questions, sort of a, an individual case by case, feel free to send us an and we will get back to you on that. But take, take that question, for instance. At this point the chances are you do not fall within the current plans of, into the, it could get a license. The question, the further notice is, going forward should certain classes of users that are not currently, offer eligible for a license be able to get a license. So that s a question in the proceeding. Sandra: We re audio taping this, which we ll post. And we ll get this address out to you. I know that this is Sandra. There are a couple of questions and people who are Yvonne Peterman from U. Texas. This is another specific one and she is not on audio. U. Texas is an authorized user who can they coordinate with at FCC? And the performing arts center there is part of the university and they re a licensed user. So, so, for everybody s benefit, who would if you are an authorized user. Who is the person you coordinate with at FCC? If you ve got questions? Page 7 of 14

8 Participant: I guess you could use. There are lots of people here that would probably be able to help. But, and I didn t mean to give the impression that everybody was not authorized. There are different users, uhm. Sandra: Yes, yes. Paul: Why don t we start with Matt for the moment and we can. What, what kind of questions does that? What kind of question do you have? I mean, it always gets into whose the proper person to get If you, if you send the precise question you have, I think we can find, we can find somebody to respond to. There s also an FCC call center that maybe able to answer some of these questions. Participant: And I think Paul brings up a Participant: I think also Leah, as a, as a sort of service to your membership. Leah: Yes. We can offer guidance on this matter because obviously we are working with the FCC on this issue. Participant: Yes, thanks (Crosstalk) Leah: If you have specific questions related to your organization, please do not hesitate to me. And I know all of you have my address. I also want to point out that the FCC has been very generous with their time in walking us through this recent decision. I want to make sure that everybody understands that this is one of the services that we provide to our members. And so, really look to us and use us as your advocate on this issue. We can help you through this. Participant: That sounds great. I appreciate that. Sandra: I think others, you re unmuted. So, go ahead and ask your questions. And many of you had questions for the entire audience. Participant: Hi. We re, I m this is Justin Strong from the Avalon Theater. I m with Brian McHartland, the owner and operator of Four Horsemen Theatricals. We re curious about if users were not, if users of wireless microphones weren t authorized in the 700 band, how is it legal for manufacturers to have sold them? Paul: This is Paul Murray. That question happened to have been raised in this proceeding in August, in July of And you get into, you get. Well, I m not going to opine on the legality of Page 8 of 14

9 it because that gets into the extent to which, what exactly a manufacturer communicated. Some, some manufacturers to my understanding is probably listed in the fine print that the service was for authorized users, or that a license was necessary. Probably different depending on with whom you re talking. But, you re asking a legal question as to whether they re liable for selling it to you. All I can do is tell you that, is that the FCC rules have been clear from the outset. That what we call Park 74 Low Power Auxiliary stations, which is essentially auxiliary stations to our television broadcast and cable operators was only, only the small class of entities were eligible. So, and we d also know obviously that a lot of wireless microphones were sold to a lot of people that were eligible. There s no good answer to your question. Participant: Thank you. Participant: Robert Murray, Gruen Opera House, Macon, Georgia. What is the frequency range of the poor T.V. section that they re going to be moving people into? Participant: I m not sure I know the specific frequencies, I should. It s going to be channeled to the, to 51. Participant: Okay. Participant: Maybe George knows the 50, 51 is going to be below 698 megahertz. Participant: Yes. Participant: And I don t know (37:58:12) is? Participant: The lowest. (Crosstalk) Participant: Ninety-eight, and I think channel, Channel 2 is what, 54 megahertz, something like that? I think it s 54 megahertz. I haven t thought about that in a long time. Participant: Doing good. So what you re saying is, is it s going to go all the way down from 698 to as low as 54 megahertz in that range? FCC: Well let me, let me actually try to put it this way. If there is a device manufactured by a manufacturer, or a wireless microphone, or a tuning device, or whatever. They would had to have been certificated by the FCC to say that they comply with the rules or, operation of parts 74 licenses. And they would have had to operate on channels that most likely are T.D. banned, which might have included 700 (38:49:69). Page 9 of 14

10 FCC: So, if you have a, if it s already been certificated by the FCC. If the FCC has already said, We got an application for a particular piece of equipment to operate under part 74 rules, it s already going to operate in appropriate bands. It may actually operate in 700 megahertz bands, which would no longer be appropriate as of, no later than June 12. But you wouldn t have been able to get these equipment. It works for you had it not satisfied certain rules. The rules that we didn t have in place was, is you can t sell. We didn t explicitly say, You cannot sell to anybody but a licensee. That was never explicitly in the rules. Participant: But my, my Participant: So. Participant: Brings up my question about that and my concern is our, my theater has (39:42:10) communication heads and communications, two-way communication in the building that is down in the 298 first 74 range. Some Telex packs that are VHS. And what I m trying to, getting the feeling of here, is that with this drop those should become, if you, those channels should be in jeopardy as well. I m being stepped on now. Participant: Well that, that. I don't know whether those channels are in jeopardy. We might depend on whether there s actually a T.V. station operating in those bands. Participant: But, now if it s a frequency selection, is a, is something that you really need to devote some engineering attention to because there are, as Paul and Matthew will point out there are certain types of public safety land mobile operations in the, in parts of the T.V. core spectrum. There are uses in the core where you probably don t want to shift to those uses. And so, or I should say to those, those particular channels. So, it s a I m not sure it s for this telephone pole but the, the distinction about what frequencies to shift to is a, is a very important consideration and probably requires engineering assistance to be, make sure that you make the right choice the first time. Participant: Thank you George, I think that (Crosstalk) Participant: Is that a (41:21:31) regional? Participant: Go ahead. Participant: Is that going to be regional? Participant: If you re Participant: Is it the? Page 10 of 14

11 Participant: Well, first of all there, there are a number of sort of engineering considerations that have to be taken into account. One of course is whether there are co-channel full-service television operations in, within a certain distance of the location where you intend to operate. Another might be whether there are certain types of Class A low-power television or translator operations, which are also in the vicinity. The FCC, or I should say this band historically, has been coordinated using a group of engineers who are basically aligned with the broadcast industry, Society of Broadcast Engineers. To select frequencies that were suitable. But of course they were only dealing with the relatively limited number of broadcast, and network, and movie, potential movie users who would seek licensing under the FCC s rules. Now that this is changing to a potentially broader group of eligible entities, I think the, the engineering component is going to be more complex. More people to take account of. More, more separate users to, to consider. And anyway, as I say, that s probably part of a separate discussion we ought to have which is more sort of engineering oriented. Participant: Thank you. Sandra: Well, I know we have time for about two or three more questions. And then we want to make sure that folks on the call can Leah Frelinghuysen at with any follow-up questions. And the questions that have come in already that we don t get to we will get those answered and we ll post them. Well, we ve got time for a couple more. Anyone else? Participant: (43:52:59) Theater. I guess our biggest concern is we re about to make, you know, $120,000 wireless purchase. And what our biggest fear is, you know, are we going to make that purchase to band. We plan to move Downing to the four T.V. area that we re talking about. And our biggest fear, and those who fund us, they re biggest fear we don t want to be looking at the same situation a year from now at a $120,000 down the road. And it seems that no one has addressed the possibility that this could happen again. Or the rules set in place within the gate. What we ve already done. And I think looking at the questions that have come across online that seems to be the biggest fear that everyone really has from an operational standpoint. Participant: Yep. And there are ways in which you could protect yourselves against that. But it has to do with the tuning range and of the devices that you re going to be purchasing, which obviously if you can, if you can select among a fairly robust group of channels if there are changes down the road and you can accommodate by shifting frequencies by simply retuning. Not re-crystalling but in some of the more sophisticated systems, you literally can turn the dial because it is a very frequency agile type of system. But anyway, that, that s as I say, that s an engineering (45:39:22). It s obviously a financial consideration but it also ties back into some very, very significant engineering issues about, you Page 11 of 14

12 know, what, what you should be buying and how much risk there is that you want to protect against in purchasing perhaps a higher end piece of equipment rather than something that is just hardwired to a particular frequency. Participant: Certainly, I mean, you know, as end-users we understand frequency agility within an allotted bandwidth, you know. In this case we re talking about four T.V. channels. But our fear is not that, that can t move within that. Our fear is that we move into this band and then two years from now, or a year from now they say, Well, we re going to have to move out of that band and go somewhere else, you know, that we don t even know. That would be out of the four T.V. band. Or some mandate that dictates that frequency agility within the system we have will no longer apply and we have to have another $120,000 rig that operates somewhere else. That s the kind of reassurance that I know that, that my bosses and my funding people are asking me everyday as I move closer to finalizing this purchase. George: Well, if that s And you ask an excellent question. And I m glad we got Paul and Matthew on. But in one of the things that the condition permits at the current time is that these relocated wireless mic operations and operate either analogue or digital. And if you look at these sort of broader market, or the most advanced technologies, digital seems to be the dominate technology that s being. The most innovative work is taking place in, in (47:39:27). And I can see that, a generational change from, from your traditional reliance on analogue technologies to digital in the not-too-distant future. And is that something that the FCC might be required to mandate in order to achieve greater spectrum efficiency? That s a question, Paul, or Matthew. Matthew: No, I understand the question, George. I, let me say this. You ve got a current proposed rule for core T.V. bands. It s not, it hasn t, it doesn t I believe, expressly indicate some discussion about narrowing the set of bands that rules going forward would involve in the nearterm. But there also is a question in the further notice not directed to the near-term. Not directed to turning around within a year or two and having to get out of the core T.V. band. That kind of question is not in the further note. But there is some question for how does the commission going forward in those, in the longer term, what might be years, to kind of encourage more effective technology to share the core T.V. band. So, that s a longer term issue does put digital, the digital devices on the table. And we actually, the FCC actually had started a series of meetings to talk with manufacturers about going forward. But that s really viewed as the very long term for making better devices that more efficiently use the spectrum that work for the user and use less spectrum, and allow other users to use the spectrum as well. But that s a long term, that s a concept that s being explored. But, the current plan is not to, is not to change the frequencies that s to be operated on in the core T.V. band. Page 12 of 14

13 (Crosstalk) George: Thank you. Participant: Wasn t the current plan prior to this decision in 2008 not changed frequencies? Participant: No, the 2008, it is the 2000 (49:58:04) total was to, was to require the piecing of operation of wireless mics in the 700 megahertz band. That never changed. Participant: I m saying, two weeks before that decision was made wasn t the plan as far as everyone knew at that point not to change the frequencies? Participant: Not to change the 700 megahertz frequencies? Participant: Right. I mean, until, until that decision was made, everyone operated under the assumption that things would continue on the status quo. What we re looking for is some kind of time frame for the next momentous change like this. Participant: Well, I, I just, I m not sure I (50:37:40) what you re saying, but I know there s several wireless manufacturers, wireless microphone manufacturers that knew about the need to leave 700 megahertz band years ago. And have been, have been stopping, you know, manufacturing facilities over the last two, three, four years. Some even longer than that. So, it s always been clear that the 700 megahertz band, once it became identified as part of the digital television transition would no longer be available for 700 megahertz wireless mics. That was not a new decision. That s been around for years. It was, it took the commission actually a long time to clarify the rules and put a fine point on it, that, that was true. But the, but the idea that wireless microphone users would have to band, that has been around for years. That s not changed. Sandra: Are there other questions? Leah: We are going to have the recording of this call available for all of our members. And for all of those follow-up questions that we re not able to answer on this call, we ll respond to each of those questions individually after the call. So, I want to thank Paul, and Matthew, and George for your time. Really, really helpful for our members to have you walk us through, what is a very important thing And I also want to make sure that everybody know this again. That you can me if you have any other follow-up questions. Sandra, do you have anything else you want to add? Sandra: Well, I just. I want to thank our panel too. I certainly want to thank Matthew, and Paul, and Leah for your work on this and George. And all of you for the good questions. I know there are a lot of questions about cost. And we, I think given the comments and questions, we ll try to also organize another call, I think George, around some of the specific engineering issues. And Page 13 of 14

14 just give people some tips as to what they need to think about. And to think about where they might move in the band of, about the tuning issue. That makes, tells me there s a need for another call. And as all of you know this is just one of the many services we offer here at Arts Presenters. We try to not only stay ahead of these issues but find ways to give you technical and information support to help you move through. So, again, I want to thank our panel and our organizers today. We ll have an audio posted as soon as possible. And we ll get responses to the questions that have already come in. And unless, George, Paul or Matthew have anything for the good of the order, I can adjourn us. Paul, Matthew, George? Any final comments? Participant: Hi, this is Paul. I just Sandra. Sandra: Okay. George: Sandra, I wanted to remind everybody that this, there are. That the FCC has requested that comments be filed on its proposals or the permanent options available for wireless mic users, you know, in the T.V. core band to be filed by February 22. And that I would expect that Arts Presenters will be, shall I say, helping to coordinate the presentation of the views of its membership by that deadline. Sandra: Absolutely. Participant: And that they re going to need a lot of feedback in order to be helpful to the FCC on these issues. Paul: And this is Paul Murray. I just want to say. This is very helpful to us as well. We know this is a difficult decision for those that have wireless microphones that are operating. And we re aware of the extent, and we knew that this would be difficult. And we re doing our best to find a home for users in the core T.V. bands that works for everybody. And so, having the comment in, expressing your concerns that you ve expressed on this call, that some of you haven t been able to communicate. That s all very helpful to us. And we do look forward to read this reading of it, and listening, and doing the best we can, so. We appreciate this call. Thank you. Sandra: That s terrific. That s, because as you said, it s difficult and expensive transition, but most of all it s the end recipients, our audiences. We want to really preserve the really fantastic quality and enhancements in the life of performing arts experience. That s the bottom line. So, thanks to you all very much for joining us today. And again, to our wonderful panelists, to Leah Frelinghuysen. Page 14 of 14

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