I'd like to ask you Mrs. Olsen if I have your permission to record this?

Interviewee: Olsen, Lucile Interviewer: Stacy Tanner Date of interview December 29, 2004 Category: World War II Status: Open Tape location: Box #58 I'd like to ask you Mrs. Olsen if I have your permission to record this? Olsen: Yes. We are doing her recollections of World War II. I'd like to get started by just asking you when and where you were born and where you grew up. Olsen: I was born in Antioch, Florida October 17,1930. Lived in Antioch until 1942, moved to Tampa and lived in Tampa until 1996 when I moved to Brandon. Okay. What was it like growing up in Antioch? Olsen: Fun! [Laughs] We walked to school. A lot of times we even went barefooted. You know the kids did. We went in the summertime to school. We started to school in April and went until about Christmas. The reason for that is so that we could work in the strawberry farms in the winter. And nearly all of the children did work in the strawberry farms. I picked strawberries everyday in the winter but Sunday. So I don't care if I never see another strawberry again! [Laughs] Pearl Harbor? I bet! Let's see. So can you tell me anything about your recollections of Olsen: Yes. I remember the day that we heard it on the radio. We had company and everybody was just absolutely devastated, you know. I can remember the adults. I was a child, but I can remember the adults just totally devastated and you know, wondering what was going to happen and that kind of thing. Did you ask what was going to happen? Did they answer you? Olsen: Well mainly we didn't know what was going to happen then. You know, they were wondering also. Were they honest with you about it? Olsen: Oh yeah. (1992_Olsen)1

How did your life change after Pearl Harbor? Did it change much? Olsen: Well, we... After we moved from Antioch to Tampa I was... Oh, I just felt so out of place because I went from a four room, four room school to a three story school. And I just felt like I didn't fit in at all. I was just... You know just felt like I didn't fit in. It took me a while to get used to it but I did. Were you involved in anything through your school for the war effort? Olsen :No, can't remember being in anything. Aluminum collections or? Olsen: No. You mentioned to me earlier that your youngest brother had polio. Did that restrict you at all when you are at home with him at all? Olsen: That didn't restrict me, but I felt guilty because he had polio and I didn't. And I... for a long time I thought it was my fault because we had been playing the day before he started hurting. We had been playing and he was in a tire and I was rolling the tire and the tire fell over and I fell on top of him. And I thought that was what had caused him to have this terrible thing. So for months I felt like it was my fault. And so I always felt real bad about it, but you know finally I realized what had happened wasn't my fault. condition? When did he, I don't want to say contract, but when you find out about his Olsen :He was about five. You were about? Olsen: I was six. I'm fifteen months older than him. Oh, okay. So y'all went to school together then? Olsen: Yeah. Was his mobility restricted at all? Olsen: Oh for a while yes. He could not move his leg at all. His leg was paralyzed up behind his back. And it took them a long time to get that worked out. In fact, he was late starting school because of it. And people in those days didn't really understand polio and they thought that because he had had it that he might give it to other people. And so he (1992_Olsen)2

couldn't start to school on time. You know, they didn't understand. And he finally was able to walk. And he was left with one leg being shorter than the other and one foot being shorter than the other and slightly deformed. But in as much as he did have the polio he was very fortunate. Yeah, definitely. Do you remember bond drives or scrap metal drives, victory gardens, or? Olsen :Oh yeah, I do remember bond drives and stamps. A while ago I said I hadn't done anything, but we did. We bought stamps. In those days you could buy the stamps and save them up til you got enough to get a bond, a war bond. And so, yes we bought the stamps and then I guess that's when Mamma then donated that truck through a victory drive or something. And they were donating things. The Model T you were talking about earlier? Olsen :The Model T, yeah. And yeah, we bought the stamps cause kids could get enough money, you know, once in a while to buy a stamp, but we couldn't buy a bond. So you could build up and buy the bond. In fact, I found some the other day where we never did get enough to buy a bond. So I had a few stamps left. I don't know where I put them now. I was going through some things. Were there any like movie theater type of things were you brought, you know, scrap aluminum? Did you do any of that? Olsen: Don't remember anything like that. What was your life like exactly? I mean, you went to school...? Olsen :We went to school and... It was hard because Mamma had to be to work so early and she didn't get home until real late. And so you know... Of course, when I got home from school I did my homework and everything. And we basically stayed here. We tried to help her as much as we could, but we were just kids, you know. I... During the time of course, I got older. I was about what; fifteen I guess when the war was over. And it restricted us because we couldn't go anywhere because of the rationing of gasoline and you had to save your tires for doing what you had to do. Naturally we only had one car. And with them working on different shifts only one of them could use the car. And usually that was my dad because of his health. Mamma was the one who had to catch the streetcar. And so it was hard, but then it was a time that all of us... everybody was doing the same thing so we didn't realize much different, you know. Where you in any kind of organizations of anything; Buys and Girls Club, Girls Scouts or anything like that? (1992_Olsen)3

Olsen: No. No. So what was like...just a regular day for you? Going to school. Did you take care of your brother at all? Did you do any cooking? Olsen: Oh yeah. You know, I tried to do some cooking. My brother and I were the ones that were home. We were real close. My other brother had gone into the Navy, after a while. And my younger brother and I, you know, we were real close. I had girlfriencls that would come over and visit. Usually they came to our house rather than me going to their house, you know. We had... We always had a lot of kids that came to the house cause Mamma and Daddy were always the kind... Well they'd rather we be home where they knew what we'd be doing than to go off somewhere where they didn't know where we were. So they didn't mind you having your friends over they just didn't want you to leave the house? Olsen: Right, right. You know, we'd go across the street because there was a girl over there my age and a boy my brother's age. And so we'd go back and forth across the street. And their mother was home all the time. So if we needed anything she was there to help us. You know. Well that's good. Olsen :That was after we got old enough to do that, go across the street. And you got to realize the street then was just a little street. It wasn't like a highway 60 or something. Or anybody? How did World War II affect your education? Did you lose any teachers? Olsen: I wasn't aware of it. I wasn't aware of the war creating a shortage of teachers, you know. I do remember that where there have always been women, ladies who were teachers though women didn't work out as much as they do now. Women for the most part didn't have a career, for the most part the women stayed home. It was the exception that the mother worked. You know, that was the exception rather than the rule in those days. And I remember wishing that my mom could be home like other mothers. You know, I remember wishing that. And I remember saying, "Oh, when I grow up, I'm not ever going to work!'' You know. Oh really! Olsen: Oh yeah, as a child that's what I thought. Boy when I grow up, I'm not ever going to work out, you know. But that's children thinking. Did your perspective change after the war once you realized what your (1992_Olsen)4

mother accomplished or anything? Olsen: Oh yeah. When you started to realize? Olsen: Oh yeah. It was about... Then I decided that you know, that there was a place in the working world for women. And I think society began to accept that better, you know then too. But, you weren't bad cause you worked, you know. And yeah, then I started thinking about things that I might want to do. all that? About when do you think that might have been when you started realizing Olsen: When I was in high school. changing? So do you think that by the end of the war that your perspective was Olsen: Yeah. How did losing your brother or him going into the Navy change your life? Olsen :Oh dramatically because in our school they had a ]program where some of the sponsors, teacher sponsors took the girls to Connecticut to work on the tobacco farms for the summer. And I was so looking forward to doing that because the girls had a great time. They earned money and it gave them a chance to get away from home for a little while. And I wanted to do that so bad. And then I got word that my brother was coming home on leave that... about the day after we were suppose to go to Connecticut. So I had to go tell the teacher that I had changed my mind and I wasn't going after I had signed up to go. But I wanted to see him, you know, because I didn't know at that point if I'd ever see him again, you know. And so that was a lot more important to me than going to Connecticut. And so I just... And when he came home, oh he said that he finally realized how much he loved his sister! And he was going to take me with him everywhere he went. Of course, that made me real happy. Didn't make his girlfriend real happy, [Laughs] but it did me. And so I was real glad I got to see him. And would you believe years later when my daughter was going to the same school that teacher was now the dean of girls and I had to go see her one time about something my daughter had done. And she looked at me and said, "Lucile, aren't I angry with you for something?" And I said, "Yes, you are." And I reminded her about the Connecticut. "Oh, that's right! I remember that." But, yeah. It brought my older brother and me a lot closer. The fact that, you know, he had gone. And he wrote me a letter after he left and told me how much he loved me and all. (1992_Olsen)5

Was he just on leave from like training or something? Olsen: Yes. He hadn't gone overseas yet, right? Olsen: He hadn't gone overseas yet at that time. He did go though later? Olsen: Yes he did. Where did he go? Olsen: He went to China. And he brought me back an authentic Japanese flag, you know, with the rising sun and a fan that they used. I think he got that in Singapore, one of those fans that you open out. And he brought me a... it was a scarf, I guess that went around your neck and it had that dragon thing on that was beautiful. The colors were beautiful and he brought me a camera from somewhere over there. And my camera got stolen out of my car not long after I got it. But yes he did, he went overseas. Let's see... Todd (Olsen'smother): figured kept them from... The torpedo followed them day and night. And he said they Olsen: A submarine, you mean. Todd: A submarine. And he happened to be going over there on a supply ship and it was a very small ship. And he said that's the only thing, being a small ship.. They must not have had but one torpedo. He said otherwise we'd have got it. He said the only place that we watched and we knew they were there. And the only thing we could think that we wasn't attacked was because we had such a small ship and they were saving it for a larger one. But you know that was something to think about a submarine following your ship! Yeah. Todd: He was lucky. He was on a supply ship, so that meant that he had enough to eat. Yeah, definitely. That's important. Let's see. I'm trying to see if any of these questions kind of relate to your experience. Olsen :Right about the end of the war this boy that I liked, I called him my boyfriend. Well he was drafted. (1992_Olsen)6

Oh really! Olsen :And in those days they took them away on a bus when they were drafted. And we had to go down to the bus station and tell them good-bye. I went when my brother left. And it gives you such a desperate feeling, you know. Oh you look at all of those boys and you wonder will they ever come back. And of course, in those days it was only boys. There were no girls going. So then when my boyfriend left, his brother had gone with me down to the bus station to see him off. And we had to ride the streetcar home. And when we got off the streetcar naturally I was crying and his brother kept singing a little song that went: He's gone, he's gone he left this morning. You know it was a song that they sang during the war. He was singing that to me to make: me cry even more. [Laughs] I did that, but the two of them were two that stayed at the house so much. The older one was a friend of my brother's. And when the war was over it was this same thing. All of us, I mean, we got together and we went up to the ice cream parlor and you know, everybody was just so happy on V-E Day and V-J Day. You know, we just oh my goodness you know, you just can't imagine how thrilled and happy we as teenagers were. And another thing as teenagers... what we did back during the war. One of the guys... it was very unusual for teenagers to have a car. That was the exception rather than the rule. Usually if a teenager was seen driving a car, he had borrowed it from his dad, you know. And once in a while their dads let them do that. But this one boy had worked and he had this old car. So we'd take a whole carload of teenagers and go to the drive-in. And we would order half the number of cold drinks that we had kids and two straws. And so that's the way we did. So we did that on V-E Day. I remember we went up to Faylor's the well-known drive-in in those days. And we would order like one coke with two straws for each two people. We did that. But it made us realize that, you know, life it short. You don't know what's going to happen. We should never leave someone we care about with angry words, you know. Isn't that the truth. Olsen: Yeah. Were you working at all during the war? Olsen: Oh, I tried. [Laughs] I went to W.T. Grant's downtowm. I don't know if you've ever heard of them. The drug store? Olsen: It was a big, we called it a ten-cent store or a dime store, but it was like a department store. You could buy... Oh yes, I remember now. It was a really large place wasn't it? (1992_Olsen)7

Olsen: Yeah, a 1arge place. So when I was fourteen I went down and got a job and I think I worked two days before they found out I had lied about my age and fired me. So then I got a job when I did turn fifteen or something, got a school permit, I got a job at Woolworth's. That was another dime store and I worked there for a while. And then the next summer I got a job at the real ritzy ladies' shop, Haber's downtown. And I was deathly afraid of elevators, but that's the job they gave me and I did it, you know. And it was the type where you had to operate the elevator. You had elevator operators. There were no automatic elevators in those days. And you had to open the door, you know. And so I got a job doing that. So you just worked in the summer mostly? Olsen: And Christmas vacation. And so you said you had your friends over and that's pretty much what you did on a day-to-day basis for entertainment, but? Olsen: Yeah. And now we had a neighborhood theater. And we, once in a while we would get to go there. You didn't go there often because you didn't have the money, but we would go there occasionally. And then we had an ice cream parlor in the neighborhood. And you know the kids gathered at the ice cream parlor when they could, when they had a little money and they could. And we had a drug store near by that, in those days, you had about three tables set up in the middle of the drug store and you could get an ice cream soda or ice cream or something like that, at the drug store. Todd: Tell her about that pretzel. What's that? Olsen: Yeah. Well our big deal when I was little kid when we lived in Antioch. The big treat of our life was to get to go to Plant City to the drug store because they made these ice cream sodas and they put a pretzel over the straw. So you got an ice cream soda with a straw and a pretzel was over the straw. Paul White's drug store, that was the big thing in those days. Oh yeah. Even back then? Olsen: Yeah. That was the big thing for us was to go to Paul White's drug store in Plant City on a Saturday afternoon. Todd: You could go there and get anything. Olsen: At the drug store. Todd: Now you go to the drugstore to get prescriptions. (1992_Olsen)8

Olsen: That's all about you'll get at the drug store anymore, but in those days your drug store, well I think they even had that like on Happy Days or something where you go to a drug store and get... Soda jerks? Olsen: Soda jerks yeah, they were at the drug store. When Mamma was growing up and lived in Plant City you didn't even have to go to the grocery store. You called them on the phone and they brought it to you. Yeah. That's true. Todd: We never went to a grocery store to buy groceries. Mamma always called them on the phone. Olsen :On the phone and they would bring it to you. But, they were even after I was... right? That sure did help though. They were still doing that during the war years Olsen :Well I don't know. We didn't have it in Tampa. Todd: No we only moved in because.... So it was just the countryside? Olsen: Yeah it was when they lived in Plant City, actually Plant City not Antioch. When Mamma was young they lived in Plant City and then they moved to Antioch. Then I lived in Antioch til we moved to Tampa, but we didn't have that in Tampa. We had to go to the grocery store. Now what they did do in Tampa was deliver milk. We had milkmen and they delivered the milk to your door. You didn't have that in Antioch? Olsen: No. No. Olsen: No, we had our own cows in Antioch. When I was a little girl living in Antioch, I had to milk the goat before I went to school. My brother milked the cow, the older one. He milked the cow and I milked the goat because the doctor said that goat milk would be good for my daddy. So he bought a goat. And so I had to milk the goat every morning before I walked about a mile and a half to school. But I loved the goat. Goats make (1992_Olsen)9

wonderful pets. They really... They are loving animals and I loved the goat so. Let's see. You talked a little bit about V-J Day, but were you... you said you went to movie theater with your friends? Olsen: Not on V-J Day we didn't want to be tied up to the movies, you know. We went to Faylor's on V-E Day. On V-J Day I think we just went to the ice cream parlor in the neighborhood, you know, just a whole bunch of us. And we were just so happy and everybody was blowing their horns everywhere. You know, if they had a car, they were blowing the horns. So we did that. We were so excited. How was your life and community changed at the end of the war? Olsen: Well the boys started coming home and you know, looking for jobs. And some of them went back to school. I had one that was in my class that came back and went to school after he came home from the war. And everybody was real happy. The girls were real happy to get all the guys back, you know [Laughs]. And so it changed in that way and then we could start buying sugar again. You could do more cause you could get gas and you know, you could get those things and we were all relieved. And some of the boys of course stayed in the service or some of them had to because they were deployed and they stayed in Germany for a long time after the war. But, for the most part, they came on home and so we were glad of that. And life settled back down again. Were you glad when your mom wasn't working at the yards anymore? Olsen: Yeah. I was glad that she didn't have to go out there but she was still working. I figured that the work was easier on her and the hours were not as long. And you know, for the most part, she worked in the daytime and didn't have to work at night. And yeah, I was real happy about that because while I was glad she had a good job during the war, you know it was hard for her some of the hours that she had to work. And then with the war over we could relax and not think well maybe tomorrow they'll be bombing over here and we could plan to go on to school and you know things like that. I just went to business school when I got out of high school. I just went to business school because I didn't have the money to go to college and in those days there were no like parttime jobs where kids could work and help pay their way through college. Todd: You couldn't get the loans that they started. Olsen: Right there were none of the student loans. You know, nowadays a lot of people can get student loans. My son did and went to college, but in those days there were no student loans and there were no McDonald's and Burger Kings and things like that where people could get a part-time job and work their way through. That's not to say that some people didn't. Some people knew someone where they could get a job and all. And some people were fortunate to do that. But I did not do that. I just went to night school. I (1992_Olsen)10

worked in the daytime and went to night school, took a business course. [talking in the background] What do you think were the most important lessons that you learned from the war? You had mentioned before not to take things for granted and...? Olsen: Right. Don't take anything for granted and don't... You really know that life is unpredictable, you know. And like I say, I learned and I think a lot of people did, don't leave your loved ones with harsh words that you don't mean. And that people have to work. Everybody has to pull together. You have to work. And I learned then that it's possible that women would have to work, you know. People in those days condemned women for working. Number one they should leave their jobs for the men, but during the war when the men were gone somebody had to do the work. So they accepted the women. And I learned that there are always circumstances that alter cases. You can't just you know everything is not just one big black and white, you know. There are circumstances that alter the cases. And you learned that. And learned to try to get along with people. When did you decide to go to college? How did you make that decision? Olsen: Well I just went to... When I was young I just went to night school. I didn't go to college until I was much older and my husband had left us. And my two older children were grown and I didn't have but one at home and he was an older teenager. Then I went back to college at night. And I just got two years out of that. So did you work outside the home once you were married? Olsen: After, let's see... I went to work after we'd been married about three and half years and my second child was born. I had to go back to work because things were just expensive and we wanted to save money and buy a home and so I went back to work. What made you go back to college later on you said? Olsen: Well after... As I got older I started out like a secretary and in high school I had wanted to be a bookkeeper. And well when I first got my job I was a bookkeeper, but then I got an opportunity to be a secretary, which paid more money. So then I went on to be a secretary cause I had taken shorthand and everything. And when I went to work there they had a credit union there. And after a while I volunteered in the credit union to... The reason I got in to that is they asked me to be the secretary to take all the notes and everything at the credit union meetings. So I started out like that. And then I decided and they wanted me to be a volunteer because the credit union is run by volunteers. The banks are run by paid directors and all of that, but the credit unions are run by people who volunteer their time to do all of this. So I decided that I would like to do that and help. I thought the credit union was a very good cause you know, people helping people. (1992_Olsen)11

And so I volunteered in that. And then as that worked progressed after several years they got this program where you could go to college and it would count as a college course, but it would also count on a program they had through the credit union of being a certified credit union executive, you know. So I thought well hey, that's a good thing. I could get both points, you know. So I did that. And I did that for nearly five years before I earned my degree as a certified credit union executive. And in the meantime then I had gotten another job as a credit and collection manager. And so that helped me with that because in taking the credit union course you got a lot of finaincial information. So by going to school at night helped me to get that job as credit and collection manager. And it helped me in it as I was doing it. And my boss there was very, very education minded. She would help me and so I did that. And I never worked for the credit union. I spent forty-nine years as a volunteer in the credit union, but I never worked for the credit union. But, it did helped me in my paid job as... I worked there for a while as a credit and collection manager and then I got an opportunity to go to work for a larger company - didn't have the manager title. I was just a supervisor, but I was a supervisor in the collection department, billing and such as that. And then I got accounts payable added to me. And so I did that for a while. Then that company was sold and went to the company that bought them and I went totally back to accounts receivable and billing and collecting. That was it. I worked there for... [conversation between Mrs. Todd and Mrs. Olsen not transcribed] Can you trace any of your successes or even any of your children's successes back to y'alls experience during the war? I mean, do you think that that it was specifically women in workplace, education any of those? Olsen: Here again. I hate to say that the war benefited us, you know, but certainly the war gave women an opportunity to work. And it also changed society's opinion to a certain extent; that women did have a place in the workforce. Now of course, women for years worked for less pay even if they did the same job. And that was really because people thought well a women is working to subsidize where a man is feeding his family. I remember going to my boss and telling him I do the same work, I have a family that I support, the same as any man is supporting his family only I had it a little harder because I had to pay babysitters where a man has his wife at home to take care of his children. I am working to support my family so why can't I have this job over here. You know well you get, "whoever heard of a woman doing this." But I do remember telling my boss that. But the war did start bringing about this thing that it was okay for women to work. Todd: They still get less pay. Olsen: Well now more or less if they've got the same job... I worked for women controllers and men controllers and as far as I know they got the same pay, you know. But, that was the general thinking at first was that women were working to subsidize their income, their family income, where men were working to support their families. And (1992_Olsen)12

then of course, you didn't hear of as many divorces back then. And that's another thing then that brought it back. And of course, you certainly were blacklisted if you were divorced, you know. That was you were blacklisted for that and being out in the workplace because most people thought that that's what caused your divorce and you just wanted to run around anyway, you know. That certainly was not the case. But yes, I think that because of the war that it did change my view and I'm sure it changed society's view of women in the workplace. I'd like to ask you if there is anything else you'd like to add to the tape regarding your experiences? Any stories you can recall? Olsen: Like Mamma, I'll probably think of it tomorrow. I didn't know you were going to ask me questions so I hadn't... [talking in the background not transcribed] Olsen: But I can remember as a child you got sick and you went to the doctor, one of these doctors in Plant City. There were about three in Plant City when I was a child and if you got sick, they took you to the doctor. The doctor mashed around on your stomach and looked at your tongue and you know took your temperature and gave you something that made you well. Nowadays you go to the doctor and they've got to send you to three of four different places to get a test done before they know what's wrong with you [Laughs] Right. So... Todd: We had one doctor in Plant City. Now we lived about nine miles to Antioch. I think that doctor could be there in nine minutes. If you called him he was there. [conversation about doctor's visits and not transcribed] I'm going to go ahead and stop the tape. I have to ask you one more time if I have permission to record this. Olsen: Yes. [End transcription] Addendum: In August 1944, I went to Georgia with one of my friends to visit her grandparents. While there, I saw several truckloads of German war prisoners going down the road. They were being taken to the tobacco and cotton barns to work. I remember thinking that they must feel that they were the luckiest men in the world to be in the U.S. as prisoners (1992_Olsen)13

rather than in Germany fighting. (1992_Olsen)14